Lenolia Gaddy, March 6th, 2014

Lenolia Gaddy, March 6th, 2014

In this interview, Lenolia Gaddy recalls how her and almost her entire family found themselves living in Detroit.

Detroit Historical Society

Detroit Historical Society

en-US

Lenolia Gaddy

Lenolia Gaddy was born in 1921. Having lived such an eventful life, she tells the stories of how her and her family have been in the city for over eighty years.

Sherrie McLendon

Detroit, MI

3/06/2014

1:16:57

Sherrie McLendon: Good afternoon.

Lenolia Gaddy: I'm good.

Sherrie McLendon: So today we're here to do our interview. Interview of the oral history on immigration to Detroit. And today I'm interviewing Lenolia Gaddy. And we've already discussed the informed consent. And I thought what the interview was about and you didn't give me your permission to interview you. So the name of the interviewee is. Interviewer is Sherrie McLendon. The name of the interviewee is the Lenolia Gaddy. Today is March 6th, 2014. The place is in the home of Lenolia Gaddy, which is located in Detroit, Michigan. And the purpose of this interview is to discuss your migration, Detroit to Detroit, and also to enhance my interviewing skills. Do I have your permission for this audio interview with Gary?

Lenolia Gaddy: Yes, you do.

Sherrie McLendon: Thank you. So first of all, I'd like to thank you for participating in my interview, and I would like to ask you, when and where were you born?

Lenolia Gaddy: Amory Mississippi Mm hmm. It's. A-M-O-R-Y.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. When's your birthday? What year were you born in?.

Lenolia Gaddy: Born May 8th, 1921.

Sherrie McLendon: So we're both. You were born in Mississippi. Where are your parents from.

Lenolia Gaddy: For that now? Mm hmm. Yes. They both were born there. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So you have this nickname of Nay nay? Yeah. Now, some people call you that. Or whether they are related to you or not, but everybody calls you nay, nay or Aunt nay. Nay. Where did that nickname come from?

Lenolia Gaddy: Well, it's a long story that comes from the beginning of my children. Mm hmm. When they were little. Okay. They was trying to call me mama. Mm hmm. And they would say it would go into Nay nay. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. So your children started their nickname from naming, and everybody. Picked up on.

Lenolia Gaddy: It. Picked it up.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. So you were born in Amery, Mississippi, in 1921.

Lenolia Gaddy: Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: And, you know, both your parents were born there? Yes. Do you know anything about your grandparents? Did they come from Mississippi as well?

Lenolia Gaddy: I don't know. They were both. I knew them. Mm hmm. Vaguely.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. Your grandmother. Your grandfather? Mm hmm. Can you tell me anything about your grandmother?

Lenolia Gaddy: Repeat.

Sherrie McLendon: Can you tell me anything about your grandmother?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yes. Oh, I have to. I had to. Grandmothers and two grandfather. Mm hmm. And my mother. My father's right. And I knew them all. Okay. And my mother's grandmother. My mother's mother. My grandmother. Right. And she took me as a pet. Mm hmm. Okay. And. We got low. Real good. Mm hmm. And I remember my father's mother. Mm hmm. She was, I don't know, little down south, but. Oh, okay. But she may not have been, but. Mm hmm. You know, we are so. So.

Sherrie McLendon: So when did you come to Detroit? Did you come as a child is going to be an adult.

Lenolia Gaddy: I wish I could remember the year. Okay. I was the teenager. Mhm. Okay. Because that was Ohio. Springfield, Ohio. Mhm. To live with my aunt.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. Uh huh.

Lenolia Gaddy: And she was gonna take me and keep raise me own husband got sick. And went to the hospital. Mhm. And he never did come back. Oh okay. Um, and they end up in Ohio called Health System, which was here living in Detroit. Mhm. And her sister said come on over and bring No here to say come out, come out and live with me and ever since.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh okay. So how long were you in Ohio. Were you there long.

Lenolia Gaddy: Not a very long time. Mhm. I don't know. I would say less than a year.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh okay. Mhm. So you came from Mississippi to Ohio. Mhm. Right. Right.

Lenolia Gaddy: Right.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. So you remember going back to your grandmother? Susie. Can you tell me anything about her or how was growing up during that time.

Lenolia Gaddy: Susie Mhm. Now I. I could tell more about her than the rest.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Because she lived with when we was little. Mhm. She live with us. There's my mother's mother.

Sherrie McLendon: Right.

Lenolia Gaddy: And. She was the sweetest lady. Mhm. She was, she was, you know, she had a lot of trouble out of me when she got rid to call my hair cause I had long hair. Mhm. And attempted, you know he and he it. Okay. And she had to run me down when I lived. Now she had to run, run down to catch me to call my hair but she would take us in her. It was not part, it was the part of the house. Mhm. And the children, she would take us in at night and tell us. But. Oh stories. Very fairy tale. Okay. But, um. And we would just love it. But it was scarce, you know. Oh, we'd be afraid to go back home. Oh, wow. She really was nice now when she passed. Mhm. I was here. I didn't know. I didn't go back, you know.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: But I knew about her passing.

Sherrie McLendon: How old were you then when you grown? Hmm? Were you grown when she passed?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, no.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, you're still a teenager?

Lenolia Gaddy: No, I was still. Pursuing. When they when she passed. They told me about it. And I could have wept that. But I didn't. Stay with the aunt.

Sherrie McLendon: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Okay. So, Susie, can you need any information about Susie, I understand if she was mixed or biracial. Your grandmother, Susie, with her father. A white man?

Lenolia Gaddy: Yes. She. Her father. Was a Baptist in a way. Okay. Yeah, no doubt about it. Mm hmm. And he was Caucasian. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So do you know if she had any, or do you she mentioned anything about. Do you remember anything about any race relations or did she have any difficulties as far as prejudice or anything like that during that time?

Lenolia Gaddy: It was really going on. But there's been little children. Mm hmm. You know, we didn't get too much out of it, but now her husband. Mm hmm. Susie's Husband.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: He was found dead on that road way out in the country. Mm hmm. And before that? No, they never did find out. You know what happened? They said rumors was going, but they never did find out what had happened. Mm hmm. And. Oh. I remember him. Good. I have a great plan to remember that now. My mother can't.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, really?

Lenolia Gaddy: Really? Hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, they brought it back here.

Lenolia Gaddy: Hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So, did all your family wind up back here eventually because you came with one of your aunts as a teenager? Right. But I know a lot of your siblings were here in Detroit. So did everybody.

Lenolia Gaddy: Nobody. But just my aunt. She was married and she was working and her husband was working at that time. He worked it Fords and she worked at Chryslers. Oh, she was one of the first Chrysler women. Oh, really? One of the group in a group. Okay. Mm hmm. And we came and just made ourselves at home. Mm hmm. And this went on in, and my aunt decided that I should go and get back in school. Mm hmm. And. So she took me to a night school in case we went against it. She went to night school with me. Okay. And she was taking, you know, place. Mm hmm. And we just enjoyed it. Okay. And. Neither one of us was working. Mm hmm. But we getting a loan. Oh, okay. And then when I get to be. Well, 17, I believe. Mm. I studied the work. My auntie got me a job. Okay. And I started the work and make it my own money and everything, and. Oh, my goodness. And, you know, my first love, it was in college at that time. They made me step in, out, in in her. In her fold, you know?

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Your mother.

Sherrie McLendon: My grandmother.

Lenolia Gaddy: Your grandmother? Yeah. And. One year I sent her a coat. Mhm. And that coat was the talk of the town, like she was rich. Something. And believe it or not, it all went down. There was a clothing store down town it called asking. Mhm. And I went and put it in the layaway and it was a dollar down and a dollar. Okay. And I would enjoy skipping down the street cubby and the went down to pay that dollar we downtown in back. Mhm. And when that coat got to her it was nothing there. Oh she loved it. Mhm.

Sherrie McLendon: So where were you working at then.

Lenolia Gaddy: When she got it. It was close to where we live. Ladies love it was a reliable linen service. Okay. And now I will separateing countenance. Separate linen. Mhm. And. I worked there until I got married. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay. Oh, no one with that. You remember what year that was that you get married? Hmm. What year did you get married? Do you remember that?

Lenolia Gaddy: I got married in 19. I got license 19. What year was that? Oh, I know. 1940. 41. 41. Okay, go ahead. It was born that right after the. Mm hmm. And the year after that? Mm hmm. Okay. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So how many children did you have?

Lenolia Gaddy: Three. And Bobby. Norman. Jackie. Mm hmm. One boy and two girls.

Sherrie McLendon: And they're all here in Detroit as well?

Lenolia Gaddy: Yes. They were all born and raised here. And Bobby went to he went and he chose to go in service at a young age. Mm hmm. That was going and be. Okay. When he was young. I think he was about 20. Mm hmm. And he made a career. Mm hmm. And service. Yes.

Sherrie McLendon: So eventually, down through the years, all of your fam, just about all of your family, all your sisters and brothers.

Lenolia Gaddy: Including my mother and your mother.

Sherrie McLendon: Eventually, everybody winds up in Detroit.

Lenolia Gaddy: Is about all but one now, Dean that with my baby brother. Mm hmm. He didn't. He came alone. It's been here. Okay. But Dean. It. It's along story Then in college ministry. Mm hmm. And. When he came out, he had a scholarship forever. Okay. That was the main thing. That one thing that helped him there. Mm hmm. And when he got out, he just went up like a balloon, going from one step to another and all. High and high and high. Oh, I see. And he got to the place where they let him just take over, you know? And he didn't. I don't know. He didn't even desire to come, I guess. But he married then and he's passed away now, you know. And the kids, he had a wife and children and they still there? Mm hmm. Some of the children, they had some, as you know, out of a place.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. Okay. So how did everyone else decide on Dean? Why they just came one by one to Detroit had everybody else wind up here?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yes now your mother? Mm hmm. She was the first one came loving grandmother.

Sherrie McLendon: Yeah. Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And she came right after I got married at the end of the same year, rather. Mm hmm. And she came, and we was glad to see she lived. When we got married, she lived with me. Mm hmm. And. We would do things together and go and, you know, enjoy one another. Mm hmm. And the rest Now, after she came. The rest is fame and land. I guess one by one instead of coming into way over here. But they didn't have too much trouble getting work.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah. It's those good old age days.

Sherrie McLendon: So at one point, Grandma, let me live with you. And I know Joyce and Bobby. They're really tight now. How are they as children?

Lenolia Gaddy: They just switched around. Go. Joyce Lee. I was the first gal and Bobby was my first doll. They both the boys, they. They were so tight together. Hmm. And I just thought maybe I said even when they grow up and they don't be so quiet, they probably walk, though, you know, looking at one anothers girlfriend, they was so tight. Leon Leary, he would take up a lot of time with them. Okay. And I remember every day. And he'd come and they'd be looking for him. He thought, what if he made an.

Sherrie McLendon: Opening.

Lenolia Gaddy: And they had to deal with it? But I was so afraid. But there's nothing to happen in your life, You know, if you live with me this way, you nanny. Uh huh. And they live the second hour from where we live.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And she was always the cutest thing. I have a picture of her now. You wouldn't. I don't know. Get it together one day and give it to you.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, she was so cute, girl. I know. Mhm. And she was always on the. I call it the days. Oh, she wouldn't, you know, if anything didn't go with her. Mhm. And Blair, her father called Muffin. Mhm. And they were so she was pretty well you know Mrs. Williams raised them mostly.

Sherrie McLendon: Right.

Lenolia Gaddy: But we was right close to it right there. Okay. And now. So. She came up. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: So. Was it I guess, was it common for, I guess, relatives to take the other relatives? Children only needed help then.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yes. And that's how I got here. Mm hmm. She needed some money. Mm hmm. And my aunt needed help.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And it was very common for one to go and live with the relatives. Hmm. Yeah. And it wasn't like giving the child away. Okay. I think it was more likely. And I hear the aunt I went to, they may have no children. Mm hmm. And? And Miss William, she needed help. Mm hmm. Your mother went there. Oh, very. And she was young when she went to live with you.

Sherrie McLendon: Right. Right. So now everybody is in Detroit. You all are grown. Everybody's here except for Dean, right? So you were the only relative leave or your only sibling left down here, But they're still other relative.

Lenolia Gaddy: All with one.

Sherrie McLendon: Other relative still there? Oh.

Lenolia Gaddy: I don't know anybody else. But we have a cousin Bailey. Mm hmm. And he still admits that he married. He's married. And he calls every so often. It's my mother's brother. Yeah. And he said, Man, you were the only one. But you always leave. Mm hmm. And. He's afraid of flying. Oh, you said he won't get out. Nobody's flying. But. He said he's elderly now. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Oh, yeah, him and Fannie Lou. But, you know, she, um. She was saying they were born in the same year in one month apart. Oh. So he's the same.

Sherrie McLendon: As he ever been here or he hasn't. Has he ever been here?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yes.

Sherrie McLendon: He doesn't fly many times.

Lenolia Gaddy: He came when my mother paid. Oh, less than he was here.

Sherrie McLendon: And when did mama pass.

Lenolia Gaddy: She passed in 19 and 1998. July 4th.

Sherrie McLendon: And how old was she?

Lenolia Gaddy: And she was 100 years. Four months In two days. Wow. She was born in 1898. Open. She passed in 1998. Hmm. Okay.

Sherrie McLendon: So do you have any information about your father? You know, you know a lot about your mother's side.

Lenolia Gaddy: I know more about my mother's side because. But I didn't know my father's mother and his father. Right. And I remember them, but not much closeness. Okay. I remember she used to live away from where we live. There. Mm hmm. And she's the only one I know could make tea cakes. Hmm. Oh, she made it. And we would go to her house. Mm hmm. And she would have all the estate built. And we'd be so glad she made the best tea cakes. And nobody got the recipe. Mm hmm. And now. We have to take what we get. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So you're known for your cooking. So maybe that's what you get from your mother.

Lenolia Gaddy: From my mother?

Sherrie McLendon: From your mother.

Lenolia Gaddy: My mother was a cook. She was a cook when I left. Really? Mm hmm. And she cooked at a boarding house. Oh, okay. And, Oh, they loved it. They loved to cook in it. She made the best dinner role of anybody. Mm hmm. And she would cook for the bowlers. Okay. When she worked there, she was one of the pastry cooks. Mm hmm. And I remember now, this was. That was really small. And go into the house where she cooked it. Mm hmm. It was another lady that was a pastry cook And. So the lady that they work for. Oh, she was real large. She had a job. Peanut butter. Eat and just eat. Now, that little spoon and that. And I thought that was so strange. Mm hmm. You know, just being kids and. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: So Mama Fannie was making these rolls because she was the cook.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yes. And even after she got here, she continued to make make rolls with known for her good rolls in addition to cooking. And I ended up. Being a cook. Oh, okay. And we did the place 11 years and four months. Oh, okay. Where I work. Mm hmm. And. And when I left. That's when I came into this. Oh. Oh. To help with the seniors and seniors.

Sherrie McLendon: So mama Fannie was a cook you are a cook. Yeah. That's when you get, though, that, uh, the peach cobbler promptly. Everybody loves your peach cobbler

Lenolia Gaddy: And that's what made me known by my peach cobbler. Yeah, but I like Apple as my favorite, so I like Apple of its own. But I cook and cook most anything. When I went to interview for my cooking for my job. They ask me what do you what do you cook? what food do you cook. And I said, I cook at in that type of food. And I said, I cook soul food. Okay. At that time, they was calling it soul food. And she said, What's wrong with soul food? Mhm. And before I left that place, they were eating soul food and love. Oh, really? Oh, yeah, they love it. Soul food. So. Game or pass on down the line.

Sherrie McLendon: Mm hmm. Right. So when you worked at that, when you working there, you were married with the kids. Smaller? Mm hmm. When you were there, were you married? than working then? Did you work during the Lennon? Oh, yeah. Married. So did you do that after that?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yeah. That after I was married mm hmm. Both my husband also went in service.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah. Now he was there. He wasn't. He didn't make a career. Mm hmm. But he was in there for a while, and. Then they built those houses temporarily. Houses you may have heard yelling for the service men wives and fmailies. Okay. And I was in one of those. Open. He adds with his little rant.

Sherrie McLendon: Where were you then? Were you still here on the road? Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Our roads are near eight mile, way out there at that time Okay. We lived there for ten years. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: And that's probably where Bobby get that initiative to go onto the service, too. And that's probably why Bobby went to the service too. Uh huh. Because of that.

Lenolia Gaddy: I don't know what he really wanted to go. After he graduated from high school. He. He didn't know that he had a job. You know, he didn't want to. He invented it in a job working in a hospital. And he didn't like it. Mm hmm. And he just made his mind up. I guess, he wanted to go. And he went. He really loved it that he stayed on. All the way to the end.

Sherrie McLendon: Maybe that was in his blood.

Lenolia Gaddy: Probably. Mm hmm. Yes.

Sherrie McLendon: Have you been back to Mississippi? since leaving. Have you been back to Mississippi? Who you at all since leaving there? Have you ever gone back to visit?

Lenolia Gaddy: I went back, went up maybe a couple of times one time and was, you know, open when I was young. But. My dad, he was a schoolteacher. Okay. At the school that we went to. Mm hmm. Most of us went to open it. And it was right there, neighbor. Mm hmm. They had. It was little, you know, small place. But now they still. We really big now. Oh, thankful. Right. And. Some members like quite a few members. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: I know once before. You say when you came here with your aunt, she was going to send you back to Mississippi and she asked you, did you want to go back to Mississippi or come to Detroit?

Lenolia Gaddy: Right. Right. When? Her husband passed. Mm hmm. They had made plans for me. She said her husband had said, hey, what's going on? They had planned on me, yet they was going to send me to school, too. And that meant that Wilberforce College was one of the big colleges they had in Springfield. Mm hmm. And they will. Oh, they was going to do so much. And, I don't know. I never seen them. Mm hmm. He passed. And that is change plans and all the plans around. Mm hmm. But he left her pretty well off. She had properties and rental properties for them. And she. The home she lived in? Mm hmm. And so she. When she decided to come here, she got a lawyer to take care of that business for her. Mm hmm. And all that was sold and everything opened.

Sherrie McLendon: So did she give you a choice to go back to Mississippi or to come to Detroit. And you chose Detroit.

Lenolia Gaddy: And they had to do like my husband did. They had to ask permission, you know, for me to come and stay for my parents. Mm hmm. And when I got ready to get married, my husband wrote a letter to my parents for information.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Well, he had no idea he got it. Hmm. So, yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: If the way your aunt had you, whenever you were, your plan was to come to Ohio. So you went to Ohio, right? Right. And he passed. Uh huh. And then I believe she gave you option to go back to Detroit or Mississippi. Yeah. And you said.

Lenolia Gaddy: Right, right, right.

Sherrie McLendon: I mean, you said Detroit. You want to go back to Detroit? Uh huh. And she and.

Lenolia Gaddy: She did not want to go back. I want to come home to Detroit. And I told you I chose to come with her.

Sherrie McLendon: So why did you choose Detroit over Mississippi? Uh.

Lenolia Gaddy: I don't know. I was like one of the children that liked to leave home. And I guess explore or whatever. So because when I was there, I was going, you know, need a place to stay and with realative. Mm hmm. Go on. So when they asked for me, I was glad. I guess Mm hmm. But it didn't, you know, like it too well. I did, like, down here. Oh, Didn't really like it too well. But. I told her. Yes, I'd rather come here with her. Mm hmm. And. I know that they were working, but I wasn't thinking about the building part, you know? Mm hmm. But they took care of me. Mm hmm. She'd go to valley clothes instead of bad. One cheap. Back to three pieces, and then the same thing.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And she was very. You know, loose with her money. Oh, Get me stuff. Mm hmm. So. Okay. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So when you all came to Detroit, what did she do? Did she work when you all came to stay with her sister?

Lenolia Gaddy: Not to work in a house wouldn't work.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And me and her would be. When we first got there. We'd go to school in line, you know, and we'd go to school at night. Through the day. We just make ourselves comfortable. Mm hmm. Content.

Sherrie McLendon: Right?

Lenolia Gaddy: Mm hmm. Okay.

Sherrie McLendon: So I know on one time we talked before about you and all of your siblings. Uh huh. And you outliving all your siblings. You all were born in Mississippi together, and you were the first one to come here. Then follow my grandma. I love you and everybody else. Mm hmm. So you're the third of the four? Oh.

Lenolia Gaddy: Children. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: They have their own. Mm hmm. So? And all your other siblings are gone. They all passed away.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, I see. Mm hmm. And they all passed away. Mm hmm. I'm always one thats left. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So, I mean, what are your feelings towards that? Do you feel any type of way about that?

Lenolia Gaddy: Well, I didn't know that elderly life could be so happy. so enjoyable. When you get elderly. It seems like. Most people are just. Mm hmm. People don't know. I went to the grocery store. Kroger? Mm hmm. You know, something like she works okay. And the cashier may have just took a liking to me. Mm hmm. If she would have. If she found out my age in the life, they look like their mother. Mm hmm. And they just. Just freely give, I don't think, looking for it, you know? But it's as if when you get old, you get more stuff. Good. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: If you can get that, get what you want, you know? Not if you don't want too much, right? Mm hmm. So am I, like, elderly age? Mm hmm. I like getting up in the morning and get my breakfast and the one about doing what I need to do. Mm hmm. And if I want to do something, if I don't want to do it, you know, I don't have to do it. Right. I just sit down and. I enjoy it. Mm hmm. I really do. So.

Sherrie McLendon: Do you have any fond memories of your siblings when you were children or adults? Anything significant that stands out? Oh.

Lenolia Gaddy: I remember. Luvy was the oldest. Mm hmm. And when my parents would go away, she would be in charge. Mm hmm. And she had. Is she has us control? Yeah. And one day, me and my brother. Older brother. Mm hmm. We was gonna let her both roam and let us do things. And so we had evidently got together. But when she dealt us that day, we was ready for. Mm hmm. And we. We did. We took a vow. We took all this, you know? And it didn't seem to help. Mm hmm. You know, it didn't help. But okay, we got by that day. Mm hmm. Because it was two on one. Two against one. Hmm. Mm hmm. But she still was the boss my parents would always leave herin charge. Mm hmm. And she would always make us know that I'm in charge. Right. And we grew up. Together like that. But she ended up coming right to me. When? But when she got a chance. Mm hmm. And she would went to college school may have a schoolteacher that she went to school for a little while. I guess she felt she didn't like it.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: And she came right here. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. And. Yes, she. And she enjoyed it. Mm hmm. I don't know. I guess not. I liked it very well, but I was thinking maybe I was the only one in Mississippi. Mm hmm. I don't. I don't have a lot of memories of fond memories. Because old people were all the people with people, you know, things that younger people would hear.

Sherrie McLendon: Right.

Lenolia Gaddy: And it didn't go to good. Mm hmm. Yes.

Sherrie McLendon: So she felt she came down on this and followed you. But she came down here. When you first get married, like me or your 20s. Mm hmm. So that would make her probably, like, in her late 20s when she came here or me. It's when.

Lenolia Gaddy: She was. She was just at college. Mm hmm. In school? Yes. Well, long enough to find out if she did live. Mm hmm. And she took off and came. But that was in 19. Right after I got married. That I got married in 41. Mm hmm. 41. And she came right after that. And so I. They may have long to. Huh? To, you know, be by myself. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. I was glad, you know, that she was. I am now so glad we had our stay together. Mm hmm. Enjoyed one another.

Sherrie McLendon: So, do you remember anything that was going on in that era? Well, she came around 1941 when everybody would come into Detroit and remember what was going on at that time in the city or during that era.

Lenolia Gaddy: Enjoy it. Mm hmm. Oh. I don't. I remember we with. You know, my. Oh, we got in with the. With our age group. Mm hmm. Yeah. And we would go places, you know? Mm hmm. Movies and get together and have a lot of fun together. Mm hmm. There were little parties and different things. And, ah, but I couldn't get with it too much because I was married. Mm hmm. When? We would all go together sometime. Mm hmm. Have fun.

Sherrie McLendon: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. So then how was the, I guess, the atmosphere or what was going on socially then? Were there any, like, race issues? Do you remember anything?

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yes.

Sherrie McLendon: Riots or anything.

Lenolia Gaddy: They had the first race that. It had to be in the 40s. Mm hmm. Cause Bobby was the baby. Mm hmm. Leon With the baby? Mm hmm. And they got the news. This the. Somebody was that they allowed him to. Came from below and said I was dragged down the street with a loudspeaker telling everybody, hit the street. Hmm. Set up the white man. White people just threw a person in the river and. And another come up to me and people started in the street. That was the worst thing that happened. Oh, we was. I remember very well. We was in in our home and we went down and looked out. Mm hmm. And white colored was after the white. The blacks was after the white. Mm hmm. And the one white boy up right there closed the bell. It was bloody. And then. It was just something to see. Really? Mm hmm. And they said if you. I mean, if people that killed someone was just too light a color, they was for white. Oh. And all. But it it looked like it went on, so. And my aunt and I live with she called and she she said oh no better come over here. She said they not frightened like they had over here. Oh okay. And so my husband took me and took the kids and we all went over to my aunt's house. Mm hmm. And got over there, and they stood near close to commercial places, you know, clothing. Oh. And they went to break in all the glass windows and everything. And it was. It was something to see. And I remember Larry come and tell it. My husband said, man said, we better go up here. They broke glass into this girl who stole a store, had hams and stuff, you know, telling people call me. And and he said, May I say, let us in, man. We've had to go up here and get our babies the milk. He said, you know, milk is a man's name, but we better go and get the babies. The me A baby was a baby early on, wasn't they? Mm hmm. And that's when that first raised smell. Well, that was a race that night. Mm hmm. And it was exciting because you didn't know it would be in it. You know, get destroyed. Didn't have a mud ring. Mm hmm. And. All up and down the street in people's yards and everywhere. Mm hmm. I was glad over it when it was over. Then I went to bed. Oh, that's cool. Okay. No food stolen. Don't get ripped off. Mm hmm. And no food and nothing. People got what they wanted to, though. Mm hmm. But I was afraid for them to go up there again. You know, they said the girls are still on the corn. But it was just the one hams and stuff out the window telling people. Come here. Mm hmm. Well, that was one that I. They had here it is a memory, you know, Go a long way. Mm hmm. Right.

Sherrie McLendon: So that was in the early 40s.

Lenolia Gaddy: Uh huh. Mm hmm. The kids were still little to even remember. Bothered me the first two.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. Mm hmm. So do you know what caused it? Yeah. I mean, you know why they took him to the lab and tried to.

Lenolia Gaddy: But they found out it was false. Mm hmm. Didn't know about it, though. Nobody in the room ever happened. But they found the people, and we heard that they had found the people that studied it, and they prosecuted. Mm hmm. But they. Sure, they had to kill it, too. Mm hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So do they know why they started that rumor?

Lenolia Gaddy: They never did find out just who did it. But they wanted it. Well, somebody they wanted to make, you know. Mm hmm. But people said they wanted to steal in order to get, you know, things to change. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. But I never experienced too much racial. Mm hmm. Yeah. Okay. Not really. Not at school work. Mm hmm. And having. Very little.

Sherrie McLendon: If you have any experience or memory from any other prejudice or anything when you were little in Mississippi. Hmm. Do you have any memory of any prejudice or anything like that when you were little in Mississippi?

Lenolia Gaddy: No, I just. Remember my dad I was so scared. He went to take a lady home that was with us. Mm hmm. had been visiting with us, and now he went in after he took her home. No, on his way. taking her saw somebody. Oh. Oh, the way he told it, it was scary. Mm hmm. Standing on the side of the street. Mm hmm. On the side of the road. And when he came back, standing in the same place. Mm hmm. They looked like a human being. And it was. It was a scary story. And. And my father was. He was he wasnt to brave, you know? He was scared too, though. Mm hmm. He would tell that look like I could feel hair standing up on my. Oh, okay. It was really something. But I don't remember really too much fun we had and. I don't remember that. And the older people would talk about things happen, but they would keep it under but, you know, cover life. Mm hmm. Until you don't talk about that. I don't know about that. Mm hmm. So we'd never be in no trouble. No trouble? Mm hmm. You know. Well, we will have free to talk. about certain things.

Sherrie McLendon: So when the older people say don't. Don't talk about that. Did you all know what they were talking about? Uh huh.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: And what was that like?

Lenolia Gaddy: They be you know, some readers have written like. This man, we know he was in the service. Mm hmm. He got out of service and things like the whites wanted to beat him up or something. Mm hmm. And he was the type with no tape, nothing from nobody. Okay. And they got into it with this man. This man. God. And they said he fought for kill. Mm hmm. And he said he probably left a blessing dead, you know? Mm hmm. Oh, really? But they just clear clearly, since he been here, he came here. Oh, really? He had relatives demand it. Mm hmm. He had relatives here, and they came here. And somebody now has a picture that they went to Chicago and got a good lawyer. Mm hmm. The man they had. And he had got married. They went and got a good lawyer. Oh. Oh, they that lawyer Mm hmm. And the lawyer cleared him up, and he could go. He can. He could even went back if he had a warning to the mess clearing. So the man pays now Mm hmm. But he. He was clear, and he pays nothing. Go see. It was. No, it was a self-defense thing. Mm hmm. And that lawyer you got in it and worked it out oh, yeah. Yeah, it was Maybe his. The pan people only live a block from where we live.

Sherrie McLendon: So when he came out of the service, he was basically saying that he was harassed or whatever by the white people in or attacked, that he fought in self-defense right here, right in Mississippi. But when he finally over the fence.

Lenolia Gaddy: You will just hear them. You never would actually see a note. You would just hear him. And, you know, let's talk about. I knew not to say nothing. So I don't have no good memories from this film at all. Not too much. You know, just being with the family. And I remember my grandfather. Mm hmm. He was real sick. And I remember hearing him say, Do you think I'm getting better? I've got a little book about himself, and it's not my bed. Okay. And, yeah. But you go up you go. You get in bed. But I don't know if he passed that way from that sickness or later on.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay. So never really experienced my friend's death or anything firsthand. You all knew.

Lenolia Gaddy: We did one on one. It was there. It was.

Sherrie McLendon: The way.

Lenolia Gaddy: It was really going on. But we was way off school. You know, very young. I remember one that we were filming with the white people and. The kids, you know, we were little kids. And little is. And one of the kids said no to a white lady. Mm hmm. And I remember. Don't say no. Don't say no to me. You don't say no. You say, yes, ma'am. guess what Happened. Mm hmm. I remember that. And? And we. Yes, children. But we know. Mm hmm. What to do.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: There's one to the left. The one in the school, you know? Mm hmm. It's like a lesson. In. You see it right there, he said. That people are all right if you just stay in your place. Mm hmm. You don't get it. Don't get across the line In a manner of speaking. Oh. But a. Lot of people, you know, stay in place. Mm hmm. Feel the spirit in army he was out the get out of the army when he got into it. And there he was, on his way, and he stopped. An old lady thousand told her what trouble she was in the tried to hit. She said, Son, you get out of here quick as you can. Hmm. They'll stop. Hmm. You get away from me. If they go. They kill you. They don't hate you. Stop. But I never really, really experienced too much. Post. If you people work for somebody, they knew what was going on and they would tell the children, you know, what to do and what to say and what not to get into. But we didn't get in trouble for long as I was say, I did get into no big trouble, but we could tell it was going on. Okay. We just went around.

Sherrie McLendon: So when you say you haven't experienced life, you didn't really experience it as a child, but you were aware of what was going on. Did you experience some here since you come to Detroit or anything like that or go?

Lenolia Gaddy: We had always heard from our people that live here that you was free. When you come here, you could say, Yeah, now. And yes, the man had said, if he hit you, you know what color not do we always do it? Everything was like that. And that's the way I. Well, had to believe in that. Everything was right. That is when we met the man. Mm hmm. Back in those days, nothing too much. No president goes up. The place that worked was a Jewish place. And they had a Jewish people would run in and. The people, black and white, would get together, you know, an old man and that loan pretty good together. And Julius, he was a Jew. A Jew. They were both okay and. And if I couldn't understand what you've been saying, if I didn't know you too. I guess they called me my name of different names and then me. Okay. And even the girls that I work with, I was the youngest one. Mm hmm. My auntie got me the job they had. She knew the place. But it.

Sherrie McLendon: Which place was this?

Lenolia Gaddy: Way I got the Linen that was here

Sherrie McLendon: Mm Hmm

Lenolia Gaddy: Okay. And I didn't experience no prejudice. Mm hmm. Not at all. It was black and white. And then we got along together. Mm hmm. I didn't be able to see no fights and nothing, you know. Okay. Did that grace right there and figure out. Hey, you.

Sherrie McLendon: So when you were in Mississippi, you didn't really experience anything but happy memories with your family. But other than that, you couldn't carry on anything. And that May is.

Lenolia Gaddy: Not do that. Hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: Anyway, Murray.

Lenolia Gaddy: I have still no idea either. Hmm. You know, nothing real.

Sherrie McLendon: And were you here for that? Do you remember the riot? There was around 1968. Yeah. Do you remember the riot? That was around 1968.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yeah, I remember that. We was. We had moved in and lived in different places, you know, And we were seeing. The same church we had now.

Sherrie McLendon: Okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Mm hmm. Oh, our old church. We would call it. Elder Peterson had been long gone. Okay. And he said he said these people were breaking up and stealing. And he said able to stand down to play ball. And they were born. And he said, look, like they don't know each other. Hmm. And now they came. I remember that day. That particular day. Mm hmm. Goes up. We were driving. I was driving and we usually come around through the drive, but they had a big curve there. Mm hmm. And when we went home, Elder Peterson said. Y'all go home rather than stay at the church. You got there and I ran over the curb. I don't know if I did it harm for the car or not, but we was getting home and all we saw. But we didn't get into no trouble. Mm hmm. We didn't see nobody going to fight and nothing to catch us. Mm hmm. And we went in the house and stayed there. Yeah, I remember that well, in 68.

Sherrie McLendon: What was that right about.

Lenolia Gaddy: Now that they said it wasn't really a race riot? Mm hmm. It was. Elder Peterson and the people they wanted to steal. Hmm. Somebody just wanted to steal what they wanted, you know? But I never really found out about the cause of it. Mm hmm. But there was a girl that went to. Mm hmm. But that was. Somebody found the dam rain all the way around the church. They said it would just break in the jewelry, pawn shops and throw stuff around. And it looked more like people wanted to steal to take stuff of set up with the way things was going. I never found out actually what involved that. Okay. But I have a feeling. Hmm.

Sherrie McLendon: So you've been here basically about, I'm going to guess about 80 years, somewhere close to there in Detroit.

Lenolia Gaddy: Very close. Mm hmm. 80 years. Yeah. Close to that. Oh. Hmm. That wasn't 80. Oh, yeah. Much more. More than 80 years. Hmm. Cause I was, like, 20 when I came here. Mm hmm. And it is, what? Uh, 14 to 14?

Sherrie McLendon: Yeah. It's 2014. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. If you came as a teenager from Mississippi to Ohio to Detroit. Correct. Then you, for all your family, eventually found.

Lenolia Gaddy: You out of.

Sherrie McLendon: Everything.

Lenolia Gaddy: And in my dad passed. I guess he would have to followed to.

Sherrie McLendon: You never came here.

Lenolia Gaddy: He had.

Sherrie McLendon: O. O. O.

Lenolia Gaddy: And I went back. I never went back there. Mm hmm. Cause I remember laying in the bed and I got worried. All of the children. Mm hmm. And they got caught. They jumped in the car, and then my brother was driving through curves, and they were coming round through the mountains and all. They made this phony face. Oh, okay. And when they all got there, they. We all got rounded back in. Somebody was telling them who they were. Daddy, this is Fred. this is Lola. And he was like. But he knew what was going on and he knew what was going on and and all the children. And this was pull up that strange, but. But all the children got round and told them all the names, you know, he draw the deep breath. Like relaxing. Hmm. And that was the last. Oh, it was the last step. And I said, that's it. In I made a remark and somebody thought that maybe I shouldn't have made it. I didn't make it out loud, but it is. All of it made leis. Oh, okay. I'll go. I was there when I was walking here, and. I just went, you know, took off all of a sudden because I was wet. We've not. We've had a week. Two weeks before then. Oh, bully phase. Mm hmm. And so we passed. And all of us then got together and buried him. Mm hmm. Now I got the lay out the next day. Mm hmm. Right away. It got there. Yeah. It looked like he was so relaxed. You know, the kids, you know.

Sherrie McLendon: All right.

Lenolia Gaddy: Girls are the most all of them was here then. But Dean too

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: Mm hmm. So then he came. He didn't live a long way. Mm hmm. But he did live right. Right there close to him. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. They got the doctor. Doctor from Nelson. Mm hmm. That night and. We start making the arrangements, they start making the burial arrangements. And my mother, she will stay at home. They are. They own their own home. She wanted to stay. I don't know where she wanted to be and I'm not. Mhm. But. After that we found only is that if she want to come, you know we found out and my sister Fanny. Mhm. She drove from, she was in Florida, she drove from Florida to Mississippi with my mother and I live alone and she wanted to bring. Mhm. She knew she was coming. Mhm. And she got, she loved it like down there.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh okay.

Lenolia Gaddy: She joined my brother into the army and he bought her a new refrigerator. Now instead of, you know, new things in a house. Mhm. And she got rid of them all them. Mhm. And when she came she came home and they heard about it being so cold here. Mhm. She didn't know that but she finally she finally got around. Mhm. She liked it. Mhm.

Sherrie McLendon: So she kind of eventually came and followed everybody else after your father passed.

Lenolia Gaddy: Uh huh. Right. And. Then when she came here like they still have. Mhm. It was a church house. Two relatives from here. Mhm. And elder Elder Peterson was over you know. Mhm. And he. Had her let her live in the church house she wanted to be. You know she, it was another lady behind the fold. Mhm. Uh huh. Cause she came in the church in Mississippi. Mhm. You know, the church went there and started the church.

Sherrie McLendon: Who came and they serve Mama Fannie.

Lenolia Gaddy: Uh huh. Oh yeah. She was in church in Mississippi. The same church. Mhm. And she went and. She got used to it, you know, And she it's just a falsehood to falsely afair for all for years. Because everybody that we've worked in and go and all but they was retired I guess didn't go to work and.

Sherrie McLendon: So eventually everybody came from Mississippi and winded up some kind of way. We ended up in Detroit.

Lenolia Gaddy: Well, I ended up in Detroit and all of the it's not it's gone. It's still.

Sherrie McLendon: Right here, very in Detroit.

Lenolia Gaddy: And everybody.

Sherrie McLendon: Else is still here.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yea, yea, yea.

Sherrie McLendon: Yea. So you were born in 1921 and you say Mama Fannie was born in 1888.

Lenolia Gaddy: In 1898.

Sherrie McLendon: So Grandma Susie was probably born in probably like 1870 something or who? Grandma Susie. Oh but she on her.

Lenolia Gaddy: Right when I was doing it when I was little.

Sherrie McLendon: Oh, really?

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah, she was all in. Hmm. When I was a little old lady that she wasn't old. Like I am in age.

Sherrie McLendon: Mm hmm. So did Grandma hardly ever tell you the stories or anything? You know, they like in slavery, in the history of slavery. Oh, man. It's just fantasy.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, my goodness. Something to scare you then. But she never talked about slavery. But my grandma Susie and her husband. Mm. I don't know. But my dad said grandmother. But I'm sure they would know something about slavery. They would know probably quite a bit about. Mhm. Oh. So. Let me see. We had a auntie that live right there too. And she was the head Melissa. Mhm. She was a bit over 100. Mhm. She was over a hundred year old and I know. Mhm. I know that she could tell you all of that but it. Mhm. Healthy by her being a hundred back then. Right. It wasn't too far from it. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm. But. It was. Oh I know. Mhm. And discrimination was going on too. Mhm. But we didn't get hung up in the burden of it and put it. I don't know some of our people ancestors may have. Mhm. But. This generation did.

Sherrie McLendon: Mhm. So do you think that might have something to do with why everybody came here. What was going on down there. Mhm. Do they. What was going on down there. Might have had something to do with why your family ended up here.

Lenolia Gaddy: Well it might have something to do with the rest though. That in luck, I mean like I really wanted to get, get away from home. Mhm. Yeah. And I'd like my mother to give proof of practice law and let me go first. Mhm. Go back home and see her face. Oh, okay. I know, but I like it in a way too. Mhm. Because when I got the chance to come I was really. Mhm. Ready to come. It may have had something to do with the race. Mhm. But I, I've heard them say that you couldn't get nowhere. Oh yeah. You know you could work out your life, you wouldn't get nowhere. Okay. Good. And prospered. Mhm. Progress. Okay. I've heard that. Say it the most. The older people. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: Well, it sounds like you have a long life here.

Lenolia Gaddy: Oh, yeah. Yes, indeed.

Sherrie McLendon: And get a lot done and work in various places.

Lenolia Gaddy: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: You know, linen place and the cooking place. Oh, and you wind up being great at the cooking.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah.

Sherrie McLendon: I think everybody knows that. Should I put in an accent?

Lenolia Gaddy: And this must be a little gift, cause I didn't go to school. Oh, yeah? When I was going to guess. Mm hmm. Night school. I did take a cooking class. Mm hmm. I had, but that didn't hit me. But you know what? Just like nothing. It was the basics of giving us the basics in cooking and how to prepare your food. Mm hmm. I remember that. Let me let you go. Made pork chop. Mm hmm. You would season them on both sides. Like, puts out on one side and sold on that. And I would just. You, you know, think you put salt on one side. Oh, okay. But they gave with the basics of mint glaze that they have. I got to cut a post. Now. When I stop. When I come from school. Mm hmm. And my teacher sent me a beautiful cut. Mm hmm. But her, you know, he wished I could continue had it. Continue. Oh, finish it. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah. But. Life has been good. Oh, and all the way. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. You know, that goes along with it, but. Right. Right. Is that outdo it? Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Okay. Yes.

Sherrie McLendon: Well, again Ms. Lenolia aunt nah nah Gaddy Uh huh. I would like that. Again, thank you for the opportunity to interview you. And I'd like to thank you for your time. Oh, and I really appreciate it.

Lenolia Gaddy: You are so welcome. I'm glad Jackie was so enthused. She was so glad that she said. Now, about that. Oh. Oh. Mm hmm. Ellen is running out the mouth.

Sherrie McLendon: Mm hmm. That's funny.

Lenolia Gaddy: Yeah. She was so happy. She said. And I'll be retiring pretty soon, and she'd say, I'll come in and give you a hand.